16 replies to this topic

[Syd]

Hi, I'm new here. In fact I'm new to programming in general. I would really appreciate some assistance if none of you are too busy. I've tried learning on my own, but there is so much information out there. I've given this much thought, and I have the following goals:

1 - Just to learn the basics, whatever they may be, and learn how to use the terminal on my computer (iBook G4, running OS X 10.4.11) properly.

2 - Learn how to compile source code.

3 - Pick one programming language, and learn it properly. I'm leaning towards Lua, as it is free and seems like it can do what I want it to.

4 - And lastly, I have always wanted to program my own roguelike game.

If any of you experts would have the patience to give some tips, and point me towards some useful info I would be so grateful. I'm really willing to put in the hours to get this stuff down. Thanks! :)

[semprance]

Hmm, looking at your last two points you'll need to know more than Lua. Lua is a scripting language, rather than a fully-fledged programming language. For programming games though it's great to know as a compliment to whatever programming language you're using.

I know sod all about Macs but presumably C++ or Java would be a good way to go. For a total newb I'm gonna say Java. Head here to check out some info and tutorials.

[WingedPanther]

You have to pick the language before you learn how to compile it. The process is language dependent.

[MeTh0Dz]

semprance said:

Hmm, looking at your last two points you'll need to know more than Lua. Lua is a scripting language, rather than a fully-fledged programming language. For programming games though it's great to know as a compliment to whatever programming language you're using.

I know sod all about Macs but presumably C++ or Java would be a good way to go. For a total newb I'm gonna say Java. Head here to check out some info and tutorials.

This is wrong. If you are interested in Lua, learn Lua. semperance just sounds like a Java fanboy.

Also, the fact that a language is a 'scripting language' doesn't prevent you from being able to write a game in it. Plenty of games are written in scripting languages.

[Syd]

Hi everyone, thanks for your replies. I should stress that I am really a newbie at programming, I know almost nothing about it. For example Winged Panther's post went right over my head. I would just really like to know where I should start as everything I read seems to tell me something different.

PS. I really am very interested in Lua, however if someone does have a better suggestion I'll consider it.

[WingedPanther]

Python is not compiled.
Java is compiled using javac
C++ is compiled with g++, or some other compiler.

The language (3) determines how you compile (2)

[DarkLordoftheMonkeys]

Syd said:

1 - Just to learn the basics, whatever they may be, and learn how to use the terminal on my computer (iBook G4, running OS X 10.4.11) properly.

Skill with the command line is a good thing to have. It's not really necessary for programming, but it provides you with a wide array of tools, such as text editors for writing source code, compilers and interpreters, a debugger, and version control software (not entirely sure what that does though). I would suggest reading Learning Unix for Mac OS X Tiger, from O'Reilly.

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2 - Learn how to compile source code.

That's really dependent on the language. If you're coding in C or C++, I would use gcc. It's fast and simple and provides verbose error messages when you mess up. Some languages are interpreted and don't need a compiler. For Javascript, for instance, you would include the source code in an HTML page and it would execute automatically when you open it in a browser.

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3 - Pick one programming language, and learn it properly. I'm leaning towards Lua, as it is free and seems like it can do what I want it to.

You'll need more than one. Most programmers know at least four languages. I would say learn several languages, one at a time, and also experiment in different ones to see what works for you. You should know at least one "hard" language. The best languages for this are C and C++. I choose C because C++ is yucky and bloated.

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4 - And lastly, I have always wanted to program my own roguelike game.

Isn't Rogue text-based? You could probably make a text-based game fairly easily in any language. In the old days, when ASCII and text games were the norm, they were commonly written in Basic. I know Hunt the Wumpus was at least.

[MeTh0Dz]

DarkLordoftheMonkeys said:

Skill with the command line is a good thing to have. It's not really necessary for programming, but it provides you with a wide array of tools, such as text editors for writing source code, compilers and interpreters, a debugger, and version control software (not entirely sure what that does though). I would suggest reading Learning Unix for Mac OS X Tiger, from O'Reilly.

Read. Version Control

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That's really dependent on the language. If you're coding in C or C++, I would use gcc. It's fast and simple and provides verbose error messages when you mess up. Some languages are interpreted and don't need a compiler. For Javascript, for instance, you would include the source code in an HTML page and it would execute automatically when you open it in a browser.

Any popular compiler is going to have 'verbose' error messages. That's a silly reason for using gcc.

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You'll need more than one. Most programmers know at least four languages. I would say learn several languages, one at a time, and also experiment in different ones to see what works for you. You should know at least one "hard" language. The best languages for this are C and C++. I choose C because C++ is yucky and bloated.

Don't make silly comments about the number of languages that 'most' programmers know. You just pulled that number out of the air. Also the word 'hard' is bad for describing programming languages, perhaps you meant low level. Picking a language and sticking to it is a good strategy for getting your foot in the door.

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Isn't Rogue text-based? You could probably make a text-based game fairly easily in any language. In the old days, when ASCII and text games were the norm, they were commonly written in Basic. I know Hunt the Wumpus was at least.

If he wants to use Lua, he should use Lua.

[DarkLordoftheMonkeys]

By hard I meant not lightweight like a scripting language. I did not mean difficult.

[MeTh0Dz]

DarkLordoftheMonkeys said:

By hard I meant not lightweight like a scripting language. I did not mean difficult.

Again what does the word 'lightweight' mean? Stop throwing around these ambiguous terms when talking about computer science topics. It's not helping anyone.

[DarkLordoftheMonkeys]

MeTh0Dz said:

Again what does the word 'lightweight' mean? Stop throwing around these ambiguous terms when talking about computer science topics. It's not helping anyone.

****, aren't we grouchy today. I've looked at several of your past posts and you seem very angry at the world. Maybe you should go back to bed now, just sleep it off.

[semprance]

MeTh0Dz said:

This is wrong. If you are interested in Lua, learn Lua. semprance just sounds like a Java fanboy.

Also, the fact that a language is a 'scripting language' doesn't prevent you from being able to write a game in it. Plenty of games are written in scripting languages.

WTF? No seriously, what the hell are you talking about? My additional comments to my post to show that I don't HATE Java as I feared that was how it would come across - you are clearly the only person to get the wrong end of the stick entirely.

Next, you're wrong. The Lua site describes it as "lightweight, made to extend programs" which is pretty much exactly what I said. You're better off leaning a good general-purpose programming language with some procedural and OOP features to program a game. Using Lua on it's own would be like trying to build a full-size castle out of lego.

Java fanboy... Seriously...