27 replies to this topic

[Cypher]

So I've been slowly learning Java for roughly 4-5 months now. Although I could have learned a ton in that time, there have been times for maybe week or two when I just don't feel like opening up Eclipse. Im happy enough when Im actually writing programs, but it seems like whenever I try and start writing something I can't seem to think of a method of going about writing it based on what little I've learned. Like I mentioned, I am completely happy when I can just sit down and, even at a slow rate, just write some code. And yeah, debugging does take some time, but most of the time I don't really mind debugging that much.

I've heard allot about Python and that allot of people recommend it as a first language due to its simplicity. Although I do like Java and hope to stick with it, how much merit is there behind the simplicity of Python for a relatively new programmer?


So all in all my question is just, would switching over to Python be a good choice based on everything I have previously said in this thread? If I were to switch though, given the amount of time I have put into Java I would eventually come back and finish learning.



Thanks in advance for any help.

[saeras]

I think that if you have a hard time opening up eclipse and start coding. Then python might be the breath of fresh air to get you going again. Python is fairly easy to learn and with previous coding experience you could go through all the basics in a weekend. So what i would do is try python out for a week or so. And it's not like your bound to one single language, you could still do java when you feel like it.
The experience gained in python can be usefull in java too.

[alienkinetics]

If you have no idea what you want to program, then you have no right to compare languages.

Decide what you want to achieve before asking such questions.

[so1i]

alienkinetics said:

If you have no idea what you want to program, then you have no right to compare languages.

Decide what you want to achieve before asking such questions.

Turning that around, it may be better to learn the basics of how to program before deciding what sort of programming it is you want to pursue.

To learn the basic fundamentals, Python is the best choice imho.

[alienkinetics]

Ha, Python has indentation errors!
Reminds me of Cobol. Eck

[saeras]

And segmentation errors if your pro like me. ^^

[alienkinetics]

Yea, I'd pick java with a decent IDE like JBuilder or Visual J#

At least the IDE and compilier will pick up most of your errors.

Btw, you can write standard Java in Visual J#. They just dont publicize the feature.

[tossy]

Python is a programming language that lets you work more quickly and integrate your systems more effectively. It supports multiple programming paradigms (primarily object oriented, imperative, and functional) and features a fully dynamic type system and automatic memory management.

[outsid3r]

For a beginner? Python, undoubted! Python now it's the main language that computer science courses have at the start! Python is great, clean syntax, fast typing, very high level language, and many cool features, surely much better than Java to learn programming. And as for advanced users, i would recommend, hmm... Python too!

[JCoder]

Quote

Python is a programming language that lets you work more quickly and integrate your systems more effectively

... than what?


I would recommend both. They are different:

Java: statically strictly typed
Python: dynamically strictly typed

Runtimes are also different:
Java: compiled to native code
Python: interpreted

This has great impact on what is Java mainly used for (large systems with high load) and what is Python used for (scripts, small webapps etc).

[Red_Shadow]

I seriously recommend that you learn Scheme as a first language.

I am of the honest opinion that functional languages, and by extension Lisp, is pretty much the best and most efficient language around.

Scheme is very simple to understand. It's clearly defined. And being a Lisp, it allows you to express your idea's much more clearly.

Keep in mind though, understanding how programming works is as important - or more - than knowing a language.

Scheme is essentially designed to understand programming, and is frequently used as a teaching language. It should let you get from idea to code faster than any other language.

[JCoder]

Quote

Scheme is very simple to understand. It's clearly defined. And being a Lisp, it allows you to express your idea's much more clearly.

Well, if you can live with crazy, unnatural prefix notation, then... yes.
And lack of static typing can make you fight with runtime bugs that in other languages are not possible.

Quote

It should let you get from idea to code faster than any other language

True, but this is not what is really that important in programming (well, Ruby fans will tell you they can code in Ruby faster than you in Scheme). Code reading and understanding speed is much more important than coding speed. Scheme is rather bad at this.